Here are the Top Ten Ways to Ruin Young Pastors. They have also been found effective on other ministry staff!
10. Promise big things in their interviews, and then pull back on those promises once the family is on site.
9. Do not bother mentoring them or investing in their personal or professional development.
8. Ask them to reach new people, but force them to think the same way as the existing staff.
7. Ask them to bring change, but do not allow them to do anything different.
6. Young Pastor’s Concerns = Never Valid. Member’s Concerns about Young Pastor = Always Valid.
5. Give them responsibility, but do not give them the authority to accomplish those things.
4. Give them greater workloads than other pastors, but also less respect.
3. Say one thing in private meetings, another thing in staff or elder meetings, and another thing in Sunday Worship.
2. Reject their ideas, tell them how to do it, and when it does not work … blame them.
1. Allow your personal insecurities to interpret the young pastor’s words and deeds as attempts to mock you or steal your job.
This post was inspired by some of my past experiences (NOT Elmbrook) and the tragic stories of a number of friends who have entered vocational ministry with passion and commitment, only to be beaten down by leadership of their churches. Some of them have left vocational ministry, all of us have considered that exit. While these friends were not perfect in every situation, none of them were slackers, whiners, heretics, immoral or insubordinate.
Surely the Church can do better than this!
June 3, 2009 at 9:08 am
sad but true. the little ‘c’ church can be a very broken place and has been responsible for unnecessary hurt. good reminder to pray.
June 3, 2009 at 10:31 am
Pray indeed Louise.
And try to give extra support to young ministry staff.
PS – Thanks for the help on twitter the other day!
June 3, 2009 at 10:24 am
Atleast 7 of the ten has happened to me. #2 happened to me only once and then I learned to say no.
June 3, 2009 at 10:28 am
I am sorry to hear that bro.
It is amazing to me to hear how often these things happen to good young pastors and ministry staff.
I pray for the grace to do better.
June 3, 2009 at 12:48 pm
good list! im 25 years old and been in min 2 years… I can see these things going on but also look at my self to see if I am doing them with the leaders under me? It would be intresting to see a list of things young pastor do to Ruin them selfs
i.e Think their are a failer if all their dreams don’t come true in the frist year…Idk
June 3, 2009 at 11:03 pm
Thanks Geoffrey.
You bring up a couple of great points!
We must always look at what we are doing to others and to ourselves – even while we take some hits.
June 3, 2009 at 12:52 pm
in my 12 years as a pastor, i think all of these happened to me. it is sad but true. hopefully we will have a generation of pastors now who have seen how to not pastor so we can lead our churches to better places.
June 3, 2009 at 11:06 pm
Thanks Josh!
Robyn and I have often said that we must keep track of things to do & not do as leaders.
We also pray for grace to avoid those follies ourselves!
June 3, 2009 at 1:00 pm
This post is very true. Church head leadership many times does this without realizing it. I have gone thru this recently and have had a hard time finding the passion and desire I once had for the church. I have become indifferent I am praying God will restore me. Great Post
June 3, 2009 at 4:45 pm
God is ready to restore us he just needs our approval and let him work in us. I have gone through a lot from a young age and I have been close to leadership and it hurts me to know how there is so much politics within a church. People always want to impress others when the only one that we should be interested in making an impression we easily forget. I have many times felt like leaving church moving on enjoying my youth making new friends out side from church. But, something always happens…. God has a different plan in my life.
June 4, 2009 at 12:17 am
Thanks Judy.
Keep on following that plan!
I do love the church, because of the good that I have seen in Her and because of what Jesus says about her.
June 3, 2009 at 11:15 pm
Josh M
I am sorry for your pain.
You are not alone my brother. It is wild how many people have viewed this today.
We are praying for you tonight.
There were times when I just had to cling to what Jesus had to say about the Church.
June 3, 2009 at 1:10 pm
I thin maybe we are forgetting that pastors are human dealing with their own issues, insecurities, etc…
is it possibility that we are not being practical and as such innovation in our approach with dealing with various levels of our relationships.
June 3, 2009 at 11:17 pm
Thanks Owusi.
Pastors are indeed human, and the relationships complex!
June 3, 2009 at 1:18 pm
24 years ago I graduated from seminary and I heard (and know) that within a year several of my class left the ministry for some of the reasons listed here. I wonder how many, nearly 25 years later, are still in ministry.
June 3, 2009 at 11:23 pm
Thanks Jim (great name!)
I remember hearing a stat about that when we graduated from seminary. It was astonishing how many of us leave vocational ministry. Back then I thought, “no way!” Now I believe it.
June 3, 2009 at 1:22 pm
I would just add that I think this has probably happened to all types of ministry positions, not just pastors. The senior pastor I used to work under did quite a bit of these and I wasn’t involved in the pastoral side of the church at all.
June 3, 2009 at 11:24 pm
Jordan – yes, it absolutely happens at all types of positions!
June 3, 2009 at 1:34 pm
This is unfortunately all to honest and real. As a young pastor myself, I know that I feel several of these things on a daily basis.
June 3, 2009 at 11:26 pm
Peter – grace and peace to you in the midst of the struggle.
June 3, 2009 at 1:46 pm
Yea, sad but true sometimes. But that just proves that we’re all in great need of his amazing grace. That’s still not an excuse to not be eating, drinking and breathing God; and if we’re doing that, then we’ll recognize these times of stupidity and be able to ask for forgiveness and move on.
Great things to ponder. Thanks for the Jim.
June 3, 2009 at 1:47 pm
Woops. I meant to say… “thanks for the thoughts Jim.”
June 3, 2009 at 11:29 pm
John – yes, all the more reason to draw closer to God (who is actually a great leader!).
June 3, 2009 at 2:10 pm
pretty much all of these have happened in my life! that’s why you start your own church!!!!
just kidding!
but it is a good reminder, when God should ever bless us with a staff, to not repeat my past!
June 3, 2009 at 11:30 pm
Plant on Vicky, plant on!!!
June 3, 2009 at 2:14 pm
I can’t believe this! Everyone of these happened to my husband in his first two years of ministry…we are now trying to decide if he should continue on…
June 3, 2009 at 11:34 pm
Carrie –
I am so very sorry for your pain.
We are passionately praying for you and your husband tonight.
Please know that there is better. No place is “perfect,” but there are healthy places out there.
It is not hopeless.
You guys can contact us via facebook, twitter, or Elmbrook if you would like to talk.
Grace and peace to you.
Jim
June 3, 2009 at 3:07 pm
My relationship with my older pastor could very easily have devolved into this. And I have heard of these problems all over the country. We as younger pastors (I’m 31) have to take responsibility for what effects these things have on us. every pastor thinks about quitting, and a season out might be good in certain situations, but we have to re engage in our own way. For many high powered young guys, going solo in a smaller church is wiser than becoming a staff guy at a multi-staff.
It is also important to know that many professionals see their first job as the one that helped them know what they really wanted to do. That can be true for us too. Often it’s the second landing that is the first good one.
June 3, 2009 at 11:40 pm
Thanks Nic. Good to hear from you. I am glad that things are working out!
I absolutely agree that we (young pastors) must take personal responsibility for our actions, attitudes and responses.
I also think that it is fair to acknowledge that sometimes leadership is so unhealthy that it has a negative impact on those who are just starting out.
June 3, 2009 at 3:12 pm
[...] Jason Stockdale, the Worship Pastor at Hope Church (a young pastor!) shared the following link with me. Lord, help us not be guilty of the following [...]
June 3, 2009 at 11:44 pm
Yes, God help us all!
June 3, 2009 at 3:19 pm
well, baby, i’d like to point out how by the grace of God, and the health of the staff at our current church, our family has been able to rebound from things I at one point wondered would ever be possible. Thank God for grace- there you can stick that in your top 10 most obvious statements. but truly…
QUICK NOTE: something suggested by another and we claimed along the way (as I read all our fellow broken people seeking to live well in spite of the pain)-
Glean all the terrible practices you see, watch how they are happening and who they hurt (other than just the immediate victim), make a list and resolve to NEVER TREAT OTHERS THIS WAY when you are eventually in charge. We can learn leadership from bad leadership, too. Otherwise it is a waste of our time, and who wants to waste time?
And pray-pray-pray to forgive those who hurt you so. It is imperative that we forgive.
Grace and peace to those hurting. Grace and peace to you.
June 3, 2009 at 11:46 pm
Yes Robyn, Elmbrook has been healing!
Great suggestions on how to move forward in health!
June 3, 2009 at 3:35 pm
Very accurate list. My son, who is on a church staff, put me on to it. I’ve spent a good part of my career counseling people in ministry. I’d like to add things like expecting his wife to be gifted in the same ways the former pastor’s wife was, consider him a heretic if he is wrestling with doctrines that others have wrestled with for generations, and blame him for all the chores that should be done by the members (eg, mow the lawn) but no one steps up to do it.
June 3, 2009 at 11:55 pm
Thanks for your comments Ken. Your additional things made me laugh until I realized the pain that they caused others.
Thank you for your work on this front. I would love to hear some of your ideas on how people can recover from this. From the response of young wounded ministers to this post, you must be pretty busy!
June 4, 2009 at 11:03 am
I focus on forgiveness when there is any sign of repentence and grief work for everything else. Radio Bible class has a booklet I wrote that can be downloaded for free: http://www.rbc.org/bible-study/discovery-series/bookletDetail.aspx?id=48044
June 4, 2009 at 10:05 pm
Yes I am a big fan of forgiveness! It is freedom.
And grief work is crucial healing.
I would say I am on the journey!
June 3, 2009 at 3:47 pm
Great dialogue … many perspectives to consider.
I’ve been in both paid and volunteer ministry/leadership and have found several of these to be painfully true in both scenarios. At times I’ve abandoned what I thought was my call because the hurt ran too deep.
Passion that isn’t deeply rooted in the conviction of a call can be squelched pretty easily. It’s tough to keep pressing forward in the mission, seeing the possibilities when others lack the vision, loving without restraint even when it’s rejected, offering grace when it’s undeserved …
Don’t have a clue how Jesus did it.
1 Cor. 15:58
June 4, 2009 at 12:09 am
Thanks Michele.
Well said!
June 3, 2009 at 4:08 pm
I would offer that all of these are true in any organization (business, non-profit, education, etc). If anything they are a reflection of our brokenness, not necessarily the church.
June 4, 2009 at 12:14 am
Thanks Jonathan.
I am sure that there is bad leadership and/ or complicated situations in any organization thanks to human brokenness. I was simply pointing out how it all to often plays out in the context of the church. I in no way believe that this is part of what Jesus has in mind for the Church!
I love the Church. She saved my life!
June 3, 2009 at 4:50 pm
Church is just hard! It should never be that way but it is. I have belonged to three different Baptist Church that all had church splits for reasons beyond my pay grade. It took its toll on my faith. The last one about did me in. I am attending another church of a different denomination that I really fill blessed and I love the worship there. But I am very hesitant to become a member and serve. I know there is no such thing as the perfect church but!!! Please pray for me.
June 4, 2009 at 12:20 am
Buster
I am sorry for all that you have gone through over these years.
That is not the way that it is supposed to be.
I pray that this will be a season of healing for you, and that God will direct you into what is next.
Keep holding on to what Jesus says about the Church!
June 4, 2009 at 4:38 pm
I appreciate that!
June 3, 2009 at 5:04 pm
I wish I wasn’t about the 15th person to respond by saying that all of these described my first decade in ministry…
I laughed at Vicky’s comment because I was noting how different my life is as a church planter!
Seriously, I don’t think the difference came from planting a church, but focusing on a different approach to “doing” church from the corporate business model we all know and love.
June 4, 2009 at 12:24 am
Thanks Bret!
My wife thinks that we would be friends.
Keep up the church planting work!
June 3, 2009 at 5:07 pm
I’m re-commenting because the contact links on my previous comment are outdated…not than anyone cares.
June 3, 2009 at 5:09 pm
…as a leadership mentor/spiritual director/soul friend to a number of bright young leaders on the grow, this is timely
…in fact one of the young pastors I meet with regularly here in the Denver area sent me this
…ALL too true in too many places
…still surprised (at a relatively vibrant 67 years olde) at how little people/leader development takes place, intentionally, in a majority of spiritual organizations, that encourage deep-change/whole-life support in all seven dimensions of one’s existence
…this is good “stuff” you are sending out
…thank you!!!
June 4, 2009 at 12:26 am
Wes – thank you for investing in others!!!
It sounds like you are doing some great things!
June 3, 2009 at 5:23 pm
[...] this be your church. [...]
June 3, 2009 at 7:09 pm
All but one of these has happened to me in my last year in ministry. Because of this, I’m currently working a temporary job trying to find a healthy church staff to serve with. Ministry is a calling, and with that call and our resolve to serve God with all of us, Satan wants to sabotage our passion, faithfulness, and the health of our souls. We must continually rely on Him and commit to impart His grace and love into our relationships with others – both in the church world and outside of it. People will fail us over and over again. We must offer forgiveness and demonstrate love, even when it hurts.
June 4, 2009 at 12:29 am
Jay
I am sorry for your pain.
I pray for continued healing, provision, and direction for you.
Thanks for your comments. Grace, love, and forgiveness is difficult, continual, and crucial.
That is a great word.
June 3, 2009 at 7:11 pm
Great observations – not only for pastors, but for working with young staff everywhere. We want fresh ideas, but only if they argree with mine or don’t rock the boat.
Remember: Sometimes sacred cows make the best hamburger!
June 4, 2009 at 12:32 am
Thanks for your observations Doug!
For the record – I have always considered you a great leader.
Thank you for the ways that you invested in me!
June 3, 2009 at 11:12 pm
Amen. Amen. Amen.
June 4, 2009 at 12:42 am
Thanks for commenting Karen!
June 4, 2009 at 1:53 am
Very true. I think pastors feel the need to come over the congregation and be the selling point of a church and that would be very stressful.
June 4, 2009 at 6:52 am
Thanks Ben.
June 4, 2009 at 7:27 am
Very true.
June 4, 2009 at 9:55 pm
I am kind of shocked at how many people have experienced many of the things on the list!
June 4, 2009 at 8:06 am
Excellent list! Creative and insightful. I know many staff pastors who would say “amen” to what you’ve written. I spend a bit of time mentoring young solo pastors in smaller church settings. Their experience is similar but different. Not as good as your list…but here are my observations regarding this group.
10. Show enthusiasm for the pastor’s philosophy of ministry and ideas in the interview, but show no interest in implementing anything once the pastor is on site.
9. Do not make sure the young pastor has an opportunity to receive mentoring from a well-qualified experienced pastor (too much time, costs to much…)
8. Ask them to reach new people, but force them to continue ministering the same way the former beloved pastor did.
7. Ask them to bring change, but create a firestorm when they make even small changes.
6. In elder’s meetings treat the young pastor with disrespect and always side with members in any conflict.
5. Place unrelenting, unrealistic expectations on them and then criticize them when they fail to meet them.
4. Expect them to do things to help the church grow, but make other time demands that prevent them from helping the church grow unless the neglect their families.
3. Elders affirm the pastor in board meetings, give qualified support in public meetings, and criticize him privately among their “friend” at the church.
2. Hold up the ministry model of the church’s “glory ears” and tell people he’s just not effective when he can’t recapture the past.
1. Treat the pastor like a hired farm hand rather than a servant of the Lord. Force his family to suffer and criticize his spiritual leadership when they begin to complain.
Thank you for starting this discussion. I believe it is honoring to God when we are open about our short-comings and take steps to address them.
Grace & peace,
Chris
Executive Vice President
Fresh Start Divorce Recovery
http://freshstartdivorcerecovery.wordpress.com/
June 4, 2009 at 9:58 pm
Wow Chris. Thanks for sharing your observation from working with wounded solo pastors. They are powerful … and painful.
Thank you so much for journeying with this important group of people!
Grace and Peace to you.
June 4, 2009 at 8:53 am
Hi Ben. W you like to be my friend
June 4, 2009 at 9:59 pm
well … sure!
June 4, 2009 at 10:53 am
Well said!
June 4, 2009 at 10:55 pm
Thanks Todd.
I just wish that it did not need to be said!
June 4, 2009 at 11:12 am
Wow, as a member of a faith with an entirely Lay ministry (I’m a Mormon) I had no idea of the difficulties faced by new Pastors in the Protestant churches. This is shocking and eye-opening. Thank you for the insight.
June 4, 2009 at 10:15 pm
Hey Sidney.
Thanks for your comments! I really appreciate that.
We certainly need to focus more on lay ministry in our churches!
I would just ask that you not allow this post to flavor your entire view of what happens in our churches. I really do love the church. There are a lot of great things going on at a lot of great churches. Some churches are deeply flawed. Some are good churches who just do not handle young pastors well. Those situations do exist (as experienced by so many in this list of comments), but that is not all that exists for our young pastors.
June 4, 2009 at 11:33 am
[...] on the Top 10 Ways to Ruin a Young Pastor. It was very thought provoking. You can see the full list here. Two that stuck out to me [...]
June 4, 2009 at 10:17 pm
Thanks for your post on this!
June 4, 2009 at 12:54 pm
Just found this post. Very true … sadly.
You might enjoy reading this e-book:
“So you don’t want to go to church anymore?”
at http://www.jakecolsen.com/ .
June 4, 2009 at 10:30 pm
Thanks!
June 4, 2009 at 1:09 pm
we are not in ministry…but have been very involved in churches for long enough to know the sadness of the truth of all you are saying.
i just wanted to say how amazed i am at how you respond to all those that comment. it says a lot about your character and who you are as a PERSON.
thanks for stepping out. sounds like you’ve touched and helped encourage LOTS through this! God uses it all, huh??
June 4, 2009 at 10:31 pm
Thanks for that Courtney.
God certainly does have a way redeeming even the things that are broken!
June 4, 2009 at 3:08 pm
Interesting list… I’m not involved “professionally” in ministry so I can’t say these things have happened to me in the context you have written. Sadly however, I think what you shared occurs in almost any profession, and represents obstacles most aspiring leaders will face at some point in their careers.
The struggle in part human nature itself. We bring in someone who we think will be a change agent, but then hesitate to give over control. We continue to see things through our old lens even though we were hoping a “new” lens would bring a different perspective. These faults cripple young leaders from the get-go and your insights should be taken to heart by anyone in the business of mentoring others (in or outside of the church).
On a side note, what you said resonates with me at the ministry level as well. So often I see the church get in the way of itself, putting “religion” ahead of faith.
June 4, 2009 at 10:32 pm
Thanks for your great insights on this Kris. Very true.
June 4, 2009 at 3:12 pm
do you think that followers of Jesus Christ even need an organized church anymore? while i like the fact that the person who posted this is interested in the strengthening of pastors just starting out, i wonder openly if people should just be worshiping Christ from home.
thank you.
June 4, 2009 at 9:01 pm
Hebrews 10:25 “Let us not give up meeting together, as some are in the habit of doing, but let us encourage one another—and all the more as you see the Day approaching.” We need each other for encouragement and accountability.
June 4, 2009 at 10:47 pm
Idaho Beef
Thanks for that thought. It is a great question.
The post was addressing a situation that happens too often within the “organized church.”
I am all for people worshiping in homes … or anywhere for that matter!
Do people “need” them? Need is a pretty big word.
I would say that when working well an “organized church” has some advantages:
- can pull together large amount of resources for significant mission
- has a wide variety of people coming together
- a gifted and empowered shepard/ teacher to empower the community
Obviously we do not always hit the mark of what we should be, but in spite of the flaws, there are some successes.
June 4, 2009 at 10:59 pm
Too many folks today forget that the Church is a gift from God and is the extension of Christ’s body on earth. Of course, we need each other. The church is a community of faith (the people) not a place to gather. Whether we want to be organized or not is plainly answered by Jesus’ model of ministry: meet in small groups for close fellowship but invite everyone to the banquet and serve others with great love, always giving glory to God.
June 4, 2009 at 4:30 pm
Jim, We’ve lived through this with other young pastors and with you, praying for you all the way. I am sorry to say this is common in many fields and it is tough to not get discouraged, especially when you are doing “God’s work.” Hiding from it will not fix it, but awareness and acting on it with prayer could make the difference. I am proud of your courage and faithfulness.
Blessings!
Love,
Cici
June 4, 2009 at 10:48 pm
Thanks for everything CiCi!
June 4, 2009 at 7:22 pm
[...] The Top Ten Ways to Ruin Young Pastors Here are the Top Ten Ways to Ruin Young Pastors. They have also been found effective on other ministry staff! 10. [...] [...]
June 5, 2009 at 8:28 am
WOW!… Great post. I have lived through this precise scenario… PS… somehow I missed that you have a blog… but now that I know, I will add it to my roster.
June 5, 2009 at 10:09 am
Thanks Brandon.
I am glad that you stayed in vocational ministry, and that we are at the same place!
You add so much to our community.
Thanks for posting it on the Brown Squirrel blog.
June 5, 2009 at 1:39 pm
Hey Jim… did you see the awesome comment I got on the post on my blog… its a classic anonymous…
June 5, 2009 at 12:34 pm
[...] Vining on 10 ways to ruin young pastors. Sadly this is very true. All of these things happened to me in my 12 years of working in churches. [...]
June 5, 2009 at 6:23 pm
Jim,
I have wanted to comment for days. I have not had much to say. It is so hard to be hurt by the church – By ministry/pastoral leadership. One learns so much from living in that but it is not a road I would ever wish on another person. EVER.
Peace, my friend!
June 6, 2009 at 12:56 am
Amy, I am glad that you stayed in!
It was great to partner with you back in the day.
It is also great to know that we continue to partner … just a little farther apart!
See you soon!
June 6, 2009 at 7:36 am
[...] The top 10 ways to ruin young pastors. [...]
June 6, 2009 at 11:20 am
Great post. I’ve been on staff at two churches, the first being the church I grew up in and the second being a church plant. In the first church I personally experienced half of those examples and saw another young pastor on staff go through the other half. I left that church nearly two years ago, yet I still get asked by people why I left and it’s like, “Do you have that kind of time? Because it’ll be a long discussion.” However, in the church plant I was associated with, I saw the complete opposite of those examples. Maybe it was because it was a church plant, so we were all “new” staff. Maybe it was the heart of the lead pastor, since he had been through some of the same stuff. I definitely learned a lot from both churches when it comes to leadership, mentoring and listening.
June 9, 2009 at 8:11 am
Jonathan,
I am sorry that you went through that much junk at a church that you had such deep roots in.
I am thrilled that you found “new life” in the church plant.
Nice work finding lessons in both.
Grace and Peace,
Jim
June 7, 2009 at 6:54 pm
Wow Jim. I read this post a few days ago and came back to see that there were 91 total comments. I guess I will weigh it.
I feel really really bad for some of you guys that have gone through this. And I know a few of you who have. I can even cite an example of someone I don’t know who moved his family across two time zones only to be let go after a year because he wasn’t ‘as traditional’ as they wanted. It is a shame when these things cut so deep and the hurts caused trickle down. But as has been mentioned, it is a result of brokenness. But the best thing about brokenness is that it leads us past the point of our trust in anything but the sufficiency of Christ and His life in and through us. And as we go through this journey of life and see others go through the same things and experience brokenness as a result, we have the unequaled privilege of sharing how God never ceases to turn what looks awful into something only He could orchestrate.
So as many of you pastors go through these things, take hope in Jesus and know that He has a plan and sees its entirety from beginning to end.
I will be praying for you all!
DuRoss
June 9, 2009 at 8:15 am
Thanks DuRoss.
It is kind of wild how many people have related to this post.
Thanks for your prayers and encouragement.
The best choice in those situations is to cling more tightly to Jesus. I actually love His ideas about the Church!
Jim
June 9, 2009 at 12:04 am
Here’s the sad number 11 to your list, Jim.
11.) Keep them in this position until they are in their late 40’s and then let them go so they can bring in some young pastors and repeat the cycle!
The burnt out, broken down middle-aged pastor fades away,used up, discouraged, broke, and disappears from church and no one really cares.
June 9, 2009 at 8:18 am
Wow, that is a sad number 11.
Let me just say that I am really sorry if that happened to you.
God cares deeply. I pray that you know that more deeply than ever.
There are some people who care. I pray that you will find them.
Grace and Peace,
Jim
July 16, 2009 at 10:07 pm
My family and I are living in Wyoming. We just moved from new york. Ive been in ministry almost2years and what weve gone thru makes me sick. I just wish people would buck up and answer questions. Especially when its dealing with picking up and moving my pregnant wife. And my two year old son.
July 18, 2009 at 8:14 pm
Ryan,
I am sorry to read what you and your family have been through. You will be in our prayers tonight.
Keep holding on to what the Church can be.
Grace and Peace,
Jim
July 21, 2009 at 5:41 am
[...] "Top Ten Ways to Ruin Young Pastors." (Thanks to Andy Rowell for this [...]
October 27, 2009 at 6:21 pm
You know it reminds me not just of church but in all aspects of all people trying to be a leader or a role model of some sort. This also seems to be like the things that break teens all the time. Especialy within their families. I would know i’ve undergone that experience.
October 29, 2009 at 7:53 pm
Sorry to hear that Gabbz.